The Right Scoop
It is unfortunate that this and other religious "topics" create a divide amongst consrvatives. I do not agree with homosexuality; however, my Lord tells me to love them and allow my actions to do my talking. That's what I try to do.
Why would a society start thinking that maybe we should rethink our position on this issue? Our position or belief does not matter at all. If we want to be included in God's kingdom, we have to align our thoughts with His thoughts and His Word clearly states what is or isn't sin.
Furthermore if we are born again we have the Holy Spirit which convicts us of sin and guides us in the way of rigtheousness, we cannot ignore God's commandment and expect to be in His will or receive His blessings or be accepted of Him now or in the next life.
This is a black and white, hard and fast rule with our God and our thoughts on the matter only affect us, it doesn't change whether God views Homosexuality differently, He already said it is an abomination and has not changed His mind.
We can only pray for those who seek to rise out of sin.
You can not pick and choose your bible verses..they must all go together..
Ye shall not add unto the word, which I command you, neither shall, ye diminish ought from it, that ye may keep the commandments of the LORD your God which I command you. (Deuteronomy 4:2)
For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book: And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book. (Revelation 22:18-19)
Lev. 18:22: “You shall not lie with a male as one lies with a female; it is an abomination.”
Lev. 20:13: “If there is a man who lies with a male as those who lie with a woman, both of them have committed a detestable act;…”
Rom. 1:26-27, ” … for their women exchanged the natural function for that which is unnatural, 27and in the same way also the men abandoned the natural function of the woman and burned in their desire toward one another, men with men committing indecent acts … “
Scoop this is a great article, Christians reading this will be able to descern what is being tought in the name of GOD, about GOD, and the Christians faith in the name of Jesus Christ.
Christians must alway's expose Apostates, it is part of the commission from Christ, even JUDE is quick to point out the examples of the Apostate and where they'll lead the people of GOD if the Apostate is not kept in check. Literally kept in check.
The "New Evangelical" or the new queen james bible, comes from the same old Devil who tried to foolishly bribe Christ with riches and then the kindoms of this world, ultimately Jesus told Lucifer, "It is written, You Shall Worship The Lord and Him Only. It's true today, Christians do this today remembering their masters example.
excellent article.
Ray Comfort put it pretty well in his latest movie "Genius". He talked to those that claimed they were Christians yet still openly sinned and were fine with it. He mentioned to be careful to not try and adopt God to our rules as opposed to us obeying His laws. In other words forming Christ and Christianity to be "convenient" for a life of sin is a dangerous road to travel.
In short, the church should inform the culture, not the other way around. When it fails, it has lost its salt and ceases to be the one, true church. Scripture says have nothing to do with such so-called Christians.
Hmmm, let me think for a second. Yep. I like it.
I did not say his post was irrelevant, as you assert, I said what he thinks and believes is irrelevant. Like one disagreeing with one or more of the laws of physics.
If you state that you don't believe in gravity, that belief is likewise irrelevant. The same God who put the laws of physics into motion and established their boundaries, also put spiritual laws in place. He then gave us the owner's manual called The Holy Bible. If you disagree with it, it doesn't matter, the laws will go on with zero deference to your beliefs, thoughts or opinions.
In other words, they are irrelevant, like I said. Hope this helps you understand my meaning.
The Bible clearly states that man shall not lie with man. So...how is it not a sin? Does it have to be in the Ten Commandments for your consideration?
Here's a curiosity for you. I posted several comments this evening, that no longer exist on this site. I posted them, I read them after they were posted, and when checking later, they no longer exist on the site. vaporized.
Could be an anomaly, I guess, but they were rather lengthy posts. Like I said, a curiosity.
Thanks for the bravery of putting this front and center Scoop. Its amazing how many of those who commented are truly ignorant of what Jesus DID and DID NOT say. And it's a shame that many Christians want to use coercion to MAKE someone "not sin" simply by passing laws or disparaging it.
Even Jesus said He didn't come to judge the world. (Jn 12:47) Yet, he certainly castigated the "religious" folk who did.
But, on the other hand, he told the woman in fornication "go and sin no more." He CLEARLY didn't just say "live and let live either."
So much of the Church is terrified of the issue of sin however, we completely bury the GRACE that Christ brought. The documentary "Lord Save Us From Ourselves" is AMAZING and extremely painful to watch as a Christian. We've telegraphed to the world that they have to quit their ACTS of sin - before Christ (or us) will accept them. And we also seem to exalt specific sins while God doesn't seeing heterosexual adultery any worse than homosexuality or murder or gluttony. Sin is sin - but our focus should be in helping them to find our Savior WHO LOVES THEM AS THEY ARE - RIGHT NOW! It is the job of the Holy Spirit to change them once they are under His authority. NOT ours to do before they even find out how REAL, compassionate and loving He is.
That isn't to say that in matters of public policy however - we have no right to call it what it is. And certainly not to legitimize or memorialize it.
Studies have show time and time again that ON WHOLE, the gay lifestyle reduces life span, quality of life and even sexual fulfillment. It's a scientific fact. However, with some hetero-married couples with miserable lives - and some seemingly fulfilled homosexuals even THAT argument takes us away from the foundation of the whole philosophy our Founders had for this country.
Washington, Jefferson, Franklin, Monroe, John Jay etc, etc, etc, ALL confirmed that they did not expect our METHOD of freedom to work without a Christian moral standard being upheld by a majority of the people. The reason is that only TRUE religion, teaches people to self govern themselves. SIN leads to problems. When people are told that there is NO single standard of behavior to idealize - then EVERY behavior is up for grabs. And this is why we have a President that feels he can kill Americans with due cause. This is why a breathing human being is unsafe in her mother's womb even days or weeks before a natural birth. This is why the man in charge of the IRS is able to cheat on his own taxes. And this is why our society - is desperately unhappy.
I have noticed on more than one occasion, that when we stay pretty much on politics, there aren't too many ripples on the water. We pretty much agree.
It is only when we get into religion, and the mystery of why we are even here in the first place, that we run into trouble.
I'm not sure I enjoy the conversations that result from that. That's just me. Not a judgement on what you want to do. You do what you like. Scoop is Scoop.
"Trying to educate the willfully ignorant. I see now I cannot help drones."
K-Bob, AmericanborninCanada, how long are you going to let this debacle proceed?
He's enjoying this. He's not doing this because of his love of God. He's doing this, because he's a Troll. A different kind of Troll. A Religious Troll. Something I didn't know existed, actually.
But he's not doing it because of his belief in Scripture. He's doing it, because he's having fun. He has met a few Biblical Scholars here, but he routinely dismisses them as lacking in knowledge of The Bible.
There is something about this person, that hints at a mental disorder of some kind. That is only my opinion. It may not necessarily be yours.
His comments are intense. His replies to your comments are intense. Everything about his personality here on Scoop, is intense. If I were physically close to this person, I would have my handgun within reach, with the safety off.
I see ABiC has shortened the stay of our little, confused neo-Catholic.
Amazing to compare how it was treated versus how any of us are treated at some liberal website. We tried, but Indiana was impervious to facts, reason, logic, and compassion.
You are obviously not going to convert me to your way of thinking and I am not going to convert you to my faith. Can we just get back to politics and all yell at the top of out lungs at Karl Rove's attempt to attack the TEA Party.
Matthew Chapter 5 Verses 10-12
10. Blessed are they who are persecuted for the sake of righteousness,for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
11. Blessed are you when they insult you and persecute you and utter every kind of evil against you [falsely] because of me.
12. Rejoice and be glad, for your reward will be great in heaven.h Thus they persecuted the prophets who were before you.
No, Indiana. We can't just get back to politics, and yell at the top of our lungs at Karl Rove's attempt to attack the Tea Party.
Because for a little while there, you lost control of yourself, and in so doing, insulted several really good people here on Scoop, myself included.
Feel free to post all the comments here on Scoop you can think of. You will never again see me respond to even one of them.
I am only one person here, and that is only my opinion, which is probably worth squat, in the big scheme of things. Still, it my own personal belief, and I live by my beliefs.
I am firing back as I wish. Those who would attempt to demean my beliefs when I never in the first place demeaned theirs deserve every word I have said. No good people to not try to impose their views on someone else, good people do not attempt to tell another person of faith that they are wrong for their beliefs, good people do not attempt to demean another Church through the faults of some. People who have commented on my first comment are mean and rude people who deserve the comments I have given on this issue, you do not attempt to be a person of reason who all or a sudden becomes righteous.
Do any of you realize that this person has tied up the entire list of Scoop's most active members for more than a day now? Excuse me, but isn't that the definition of a Troll?
I left this conversation some twenty hours ago, and I come back this evening, and it's still here. The myriad of comments in the interim, have not solved a thing.
It's getting a little tiresome. Since when did The Right Scoop become a platform for Catholicism?
Since when did The Right Scoop give up the wonderful mix of opinions and personalities that make Scoop what it is each evening?
We have many faiths in this country, for a very good reason. Quite simply, because there are many paths to Salvation.
I am insulted that one person can come here to this site, preaching and arguing with everyone present, that only the Catholic Church, can save your soul.
For twenty-four hours now, that is what has occupied both the content and the dialogue of this site we all cherish and call home. That we should all be Catholic. That the Catholic Church is the only true Church.
Myself, and many others here, seem to have a different opinion. Trying to impress that idea upon this person, has been seemingly impossible.
At what point, do you just give up and move on?
I don't know about the rest of you, but I'm there right now.
I did appreciate all your comments, though. I learned a lot. I always learn a lot on Scoop.
I didn't get here until 24 hours after my last visit, so I missed today's foolishness.
All I can say is, we don't have to respond to these folks right away. We can let their noise cool for a while. Maybe they'll lose interest. We'll try to be more watchful, though.
There are very pure 6 year old gay boys. I fail to see that their being a gay person, makes them a sinner. There are also VERY good 20 year old gay young men who are virgins who live lives of service to others. I fail to see how they are sinning.
If someone is 6 years old and aware of being gay or straight someone has sexually molested you or has been exposing you to inappropirate behaviour or material.
I know I haven't posted in a long while, but this topic has compelled me to share with everyone this 4-part series by Sr. Pastor Andy Stanley on the topic of sin. I am a Roman Catholic, but I choose worship at Northpoint Community Church in Alpharetta, GA (Atlanta area for everyone else...) because of the keen gift given him by God to spread his word in such a way as to leave me feeling closer to Jesus Christ than I have ever felt. That said, I am still a Roman Catholic and proud of it :)
Please, enjoy this moving message on sin and why we sin...and if we could just convince ourselves that sin is no longer master...The world will move...In the RIGHT direction.
Enjoy... I know I did.
And there it is....the bigotry of anti-gay TRS readers. Thank you, Laurel, Rshill7, freeperjim, sDee, badbadlibs, crosshr, white531, On The Mark, 911Infidel and AmericanborninCanada for proving the the Republican is indeed a small tent.
And a special shout out to kssturgis62 for stating that, "homosexuality is called an abominattion...because it is a worse sin than murder." So, you are saying that me finding love with another man is worse than vile murderers such as Ted Bundy, Timothy McVeigh, and the Sandy Hook shooter. That is a wonderful thing to say, thank you.
And there it is... bullying and name-calling when there is no rational argument to be made. My favorite, of course, is the "quote" creatively edited in order to thoroughly and intentionally misrepresent what was actually said. NBC and Dan Savage would be proud.
No, T, thank you for considering me worthy of your insults, but still more for giving me the honor of being considered worthy of the fine and highly commendable company of courageous and compassionate Christians, Conservatives, and Patriots.
That is not WHAT I SAID - IF YOU ARE GOING TO QUOTE ME QUOTE ME CORRECTLY !!
TO QUOTE MYSELF I SAID THE FOLLOWING :
Homosexuality is called an Abomination - Not because it is a worse sin than murder, but because it goes against God's Perfect Plan of Creation. Homosexuality is a sin, God does not put sin on levels. No sin is worse than any other. All Sin is separation from God.
MY SINS ARE NO DIFFERENT THAN THEIR SIN. ALL OF US ARE SINNERS, I HAVE CHOSEN TO ACCEPT JESUS CHRIST AS MY SAVIOR AND THERE ARE MANY THINGS I DID BEFORE I HAD CHRIST THAT I DO NO MORE.
Before you go on a Tangent and spout off your mouth, Please Quote people correctly. God does not have Level to sins. No ones sins are worse off than anything I did. Are they pretty terrible yes, are they downright disgusting yes, but there is no level to sin. The Lord Says ALL SIN IS SEPARATION FROM GOD.
Homosexuality is called an Abomination - Not because it is a worse sin than murder, but because it goes against God's Perfect Plan of Creation. Homosexuality is a sin, God does not put sin on levels. No sin is worse than any other. All Sin is separation from God.
Isaiah 59:2 (KJV) 2 But your iniquities have separated between you and your God, and your sins have hid his face from you, that he will not hear.
Romans 6:23 (KJV) 23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ
The Lords Word is very Clear on Homosexuality, From the Old thru the New Testament.
Leviticus Chapter 18 Verse 22 (KJV)
22 Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination.
Leviticus Chapter 20 Verse 13
13 If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.
1 Corinthians Chapter 6 verse 9
9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
1 Corinthians Chapter 6 Verse 13
13 Meats for the belly, and the belly for meats: but God shall destroy both it and them. Now the body is not for fornication, but for the Lord; and the Lord for the body.
1 Corinthians Chapter 7 Verse 2
2 Nevertheless, to avoid fornication, let every man have his own wife, and let every woman have her own husband.
1 Corinthians Chapter 6 Verse 18
18 Flee fornication. Every sin that a man doeth is without the body; but he that committeth fornication sinneth against his own body.
Ephesians Chapter 5 Verse 3
3 But fornication, and all uncleanness, or covetousness, let it not be once named among you, as becometh saints;
Colossians Chapter 3 Verses 5 & 6
5 Mortify therefore your members which are upon the earth; fornication, uncleanness, inordinate affection, evil concupiscence, and covetousness, which is idolatry:
6 For which things' sake the wrath of God cometh on the children of disobedience:
Revelation Chapter 21 Verse 8
8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.
1 Thessalonians Chapter 3 Verse 3 to 7
3 That no man should be moved by these afflictions: for yourselves know that we are appointed thereunto.
4 For verily, when we were with you, we told you before that we should suffer tribulation; even as it came to pass, and ye know.
5 For this cause, when I could no longer forbear, I sent to know your faith, lest by some means the tempter have tempted you, and our labour be in vain.
6 But now when Timotheus came from you unto us, and brought us good tidings of your faith and charity, and that ye have good remembrance of us always, desiring greatly to see us, as we also to see you:
7 Therefore, brethren, we were comforted over you in all our affliction and distress by your faith:
2 Timothy Chapter 3 Verses 1 to 7
1 This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come.
2 For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,
3 Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good,
4 Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;
5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.
6 For of this sort are they which creep into houses, and lead captive silly women laden with sins, led away with divers lusts,
7 Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.
I see there are quite a few misinformed posters about whether the Bible says homosexuality is a sin. Indeed it does say it is a sin. Here is just one of many statements written in the Bible. This one is by the Apostle Paul:
(1 Corinthians 6:9-11) 9 What! Do YOU not know that unrighteous persons will not inherit God’s kingdom? Do not be misled. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men kept for unnatural purposes, nor men who lie with men, 10 nor thieves, nor greedy persons, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit God’s kingdom. 11 And yet that is what some of YOU were. But YOU have been washed clean, but YOU have been sanctified, but YOU have been declared righteous in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ and with the spirit of our God. . .
The ultimate test is what you do when someone is dying of AIDS. There is no hope for the body; there is only the eternal soul to save.
Good priests, friends, and family will council the man, try to bring him to peace with God, encourage him to ask for forgiveness for his sins.
Gay activists will tell him there was nothing wrong with what he did.
Do you have children? If your beautiful wonderful child intelligent thoughtful child at age 15 told you she was gay what would you advise? My daughter was in catholic school from age 5 to 14 and had to listen to how she was a sinner. She's always been different and is now in High School trying to figure it all out. Do I tell her she's abnormal and drive her to self hate and destruction? Do I calmly support her with love and hope she finds a happy life? I've advised her to take it slow, she's more than her sexuality and let herself be a kid without taking on the social issues in the world at her age. She's still the same wonderful person and in no way a sinner I appreciate indiana's comments that being gay isn't a sin. It just is. Walk a mile in my shoes and see how it feels.
There is a reason our society and culture have the old adage "Silver tongued Devil". Chalke is one of millions that have fallen and fit that category.
Liberal Christians are responsible for putting up a wall to prevent people with abnormal and dangersous lifestyles from coming to the source of real help, grace and love that they so desperately need.
It's like telling an addict they don't need to change...despite the fact that their behaviors are killing them and causing pain to their loved ones.
Jesus denounced the Scribes and Pharisees for doing the same thing. Scripture consistently denounces those who call evil good, who cause young people harm, and those who distort the truth.
Emotions and feelings are NOT a person's identity or orientation, and do not make them a separate gender. They are a psychological phenomenon, and symptom.
Same-sex attraction is a conditioned or learned response, often beginning in early childhood. It is shaped by parents, caregivers, and the spiritual, emotional, physical and relational dynamics in the child's environment.
Acting out of these feelings is correlated with very negative outcomes.
I agree with you completely, but this question came to my mind: What about the rare cases in which someone is born with a non-specific gender? Usually the parents choose the gender for the child and have surgery done on the child to make it male or female. Then the child is given hormones to help his/her body grow accordingly. But what if the parents chose wrong?
Weird question, I know but such a case is occurring with the girl scouts in which a troop allowed a "boy" to join.
The sexual political activists are leading people with same-sex attraction of every age into a life of disease, depression, addiction, suicide and early death...particularly males and particularly black males.
"It has been over 30 years since the first gay men were diagnosed with what would later be called AIDS. Since then over 300,000 men who have sex with men (MSM) have died of AIDS, and 6,000 are expected to die this year and every year for the foreseeable future. In 2008, 17,940 MSM were diagnosed with HIV infections, an increase of 17% from 2005. MSM accounted for 53% of all new infections. It is estimated that one half million MSM are currently infected with HIV. According to a report from the CDC, one in five sexually active gay and bisexuals is carrying the AIDS virus and nearly half of those infected don’t know it. MSM are 44 to 86 times more likely to be diagnosed HIV positive than men who don’t."
http://daleoleary.wordpress.com/2012/11/30/the-syndemic-of-stds-among-gay-men/
Same-sex attraction is a symptom, a sign of abnormality, a sign that something is wrong. It is not a sign of a separate identity, orientation or 'gender' - all those concepts are inventions of the pansexual activists who concocted them for propaganda purposes, to defend their lifestyles.
There is no such thing as a 'gay/straight' dichotomy - that is also a sexual activist invention.
Many churches have been infiltrated, indoctrinated and subjugated just like our other institutions. Anyone Christian or non-Christian knows homosexuality practiced and condoned is a degradation of the society as a whole. I believe it's true that this man's teachings are meant to lead homosexuals and Christians who believe him to hell and that is the goal. If you belong to a bible based church you already know this.
I just got in on this thread this morning, and by the looks of things everyone was up pretty late last night going back and forth.
I only have one question... was there a full moon out last night or someting?
P.S. Isn't this a great site... honestly... views and ideas kicked about here, and with rare exceptions, people are fairly well respected (barring trolls that is).
http://whackatroll.files.wordpress.com/2010/04/bridgetroll-copy.jpg?w=720
And at Scoop we have NO PROBLEM with weapons in the hands of our trolls here.
http://whackatroll.files.wordpress.com/2010/04/shootmouthexample.jpg?w=720
Not sure if this is in defense of Indiana or whomever.
Let's assume Indiana is not gay. Is it okay to "think" it is ok to be homosexual even tho you are not homosexual? Is it a sin to think something? Because it is an abomination to be a homosexual, but what about thinking something?
Let's say I have a good christian friend - I think they are prone to lie to be "politically correct", and I know God hates a liar.
I still think that person is going to heaven because they have a relationship with Jesus and I think it's a relationship not a religion.
I really don't know if thinking something - (not lusting) - prevents us from having a relationship with Jesus.
Although I do know in "end times" - political correctness means making evil good and good evil and that is where we are today - even with lots of christians I know.
Our thoughts can lead us to sin. This is why Jesus said looking at a woman with lust was as bad as adultery and wishing someone dead was as bad as murder.
When we see it from that perspective, we realize we have broken all of the commandments. It also enables us to have compassion toward those who sin against us, leading us to forgive them - just as our Father forgives us.
Without repentance(turning away)there is no forgiveness,period.To condone such behavior is to condemn these people to hell.And IMO,the worst part of hell is eternal separation from God.
One of the best books on the subject from a Christian Perspective is The Complete Christian Guide To Understanding Homosexuality by Joe Dallas. It presents a comprehensive analysis of the pertinent biblical passages which are being ignored or misinterpreted by gay apologists. Of course, we should love them as fellow citizens and humans but realize it's a sin in both the O.T and the N.T.
One of the best books from a christian perspective is the Complete Christian Guide To Understinding Homosexuality by Joe Dallas and Nancy Heche. it goes into detail on the biblical passages pertaining to this subject some of which have been misinterpreted by gay apologists. The Bible definitely condemns it in both testaments although of course we should be kind and considerate toward those with this inclination.
I find it easiest to explain to people that ANY sexual conduct outside of marriage is sinful. Jesus makes it clear that marriage is between one man and one woman when he was discussing divorce with the Pharisees. Mark 10:6-9
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