The Right Scoop- RedDogReport
Libertarians are easy to love when they are talking about the role of government, constitution, economy, budget or deficit, but when they stray into societal issues, they sometimes come off very cringeworthy.
Brian O'Connor
http://www.RedDogReport.com
@RedDogReport - Jaynie59
Hamas is a legitimate government. They won the election. Paul was right in what he said. Until people understand what Islam is, they shouldn't be surprised when the people we are fighting to “free” vote for Islamic rule. They're Muslims. You shouldn't expect them to vote any other way. Any Muslim who claims they don't want Israel destroyed is either lying or is not a real Muslim.
Paul is a nut. I'm not arguing that he isn't. But the only difference between him and Obama when it comes to US foreign policy is that Paul is honest about his views. He's an honest nut.
- KeninMontana
Legitimate or not it really doesn't matter in the international scheme of things until your government is officially recognized by other nations. Can Hamas rule Gaza? Well they do as far as they and the majority of the people living in Gaza are concerned. However until they come to grips with the fact that Israel isn't going anywhere they will continue to be isolated and largely ignored by other nations. Their stance of committing themselves to the destruction of another nation (a nation that has been recognized by the majority of nations) they will not have any real creditability as a government. At this point Hamas is acting like a petulant overgrown child ,one possessing lethal weaponry and a desire to use it.
I agree with RedDog in that Libertarians tend to get kind of flaky when it comes to foreign policy and Ron Paul seems to be no exception to the rule. - williamm
It's time the old fart is put out to pasture. It's obvious he hasn't done his homework on this issue.
- RedDogReport
Hamas was elected to be the government, but as yet they have abdicated their responsibility. The only government function that they have taken up is waging a terrorist war on their neighbor.
Brian O'Connor
http://www.RedDogReport.com
@RedDogReport - Tyler
Whether we like it or not, he's right about them being a legitimate government of sorts. They're not a good government by most of the world's standards and they might not do what most people think a government should do…but even a tyrannical group of jihadist terrorists is a legitimate government when there is nothing else to rule the region.
Now, I'm more with Beck on our foreign policy than Paul. I think we should stay the heck out of everyone else's business and work on cleaning house and securing our own borders, but it took time to get us into this “world police” business and it's gonna take time to get ourselves out of it.
As long as this notion that we have to be the saviors of everything and everyone is still in effect…I don't see it happenin though.
- http://stopislamizationofamerica.blogspot.com/ Art Telles
Dittos…
Except, I would change the word picture to something more benign, such as,
Somebody, please put a friendly hand on Ron Paul's shoulder, gripped tightly but gently and escort him to the exit… stage, uh, oh, I don't really know… ok, stage right… I think.
Sometimes my hurmor reminds me of Beck.
Art
- http://www.facebook.com/bruce.a.hedrick Bruce Allen Hedrick
Holy smokes. Legitimate sovereign peoples w/o a legitimate tidbit of land. You think Ron missed a class or two on Westphalian Sovereignty?
- pambas
Sorry but in this case it is the RIGHTSCOOP/The people responsible for this website, who are being idiotic !
What Ron said is that as far as ELECTIONS GOES, HAMAS is legitimate … the people there elected the kooks and they are getting kocked in the process and it is the palestinian sole fault.
This is just proof of the American hypocrisy … You guys are supporting a thug who rigged and election in Afganistan and now rule has a sadomachiste dictator … the only legitimacy is ''choosen by the US'' right ?
Leave paul alone, his statement are not controversial at all !
At best he wrong on the nature of the blokade, since Hamas is indeed trying to get weapons to kill Israelis civilians and Israel have a right to stop them … but he might not want to go down that road or you guys whould like to have him support bombing Iran
- http://www.facebook.com/Tom.with.a.Dream Tom McCaffrey
Skimming the comments to date, I have to agree with most (and therefore disagree with RightScoop, sorry). Ron Paul is a bit kooky, which he nearly admitted to in his comments to Imus, on foreign policy but he was 100% correct in saying that Hamas is the legitimate government.
We may not like it, and the people who elected them may not like it (since they have abdicated their governing responsibility as some here have pointed out) but tough beans! It's not for us to like or dislike. (Now we are free to dislike the election of Obama by people who may now be regretting that vote, but that is a different thread.)
Does anyone recall Beck discussing the expectation the Founders had for our foreign policy? He teaches us that they wanted us to be like Switzerland. Kind of like Ron Paul desires… I was never much a Ron “R<EVOL>ution” Paul devotee but I've noticed that he is quite right on a number of topics…
- williamm
If Ron Paul had been president in 1941, we would never gone to war. We would just wave the white flag and learned to speak German or Japanese. At least you admit the the guy is a bit kooky. No sanctions against Iran. That's far more than kooky, that's insane. This thing about Hamas being an elected government is BS. It's an elected government that wants to destroy Israel and this country. We can't keep kissing the butt of our enemy. They see that as a weakness.
- KeninMontana
Hmm, not sure where you're coming from on the your opening statement. As far as Hamas being legitimate by virtue of elections no one is really disputing that, the crux of the issue is the blockade of Gaza by Israel and Egypt and its legitimacy. The blockade is legal under international law, there exists a state of war between the Hamas government and Israel, it has been declared and conducted under laws established and recognized by the international community. Humanitarian aid has been and is allowed in as well as delivered.
As to your comment on US hypocrisy in regards to the Afghan government, we as a nation are not alone in our recognition of the Karzai coalition government, is his government corrupt? Yes, and it has been called out for it's practices. Are you saying that the US should remove Karzai by force or support someone else doing it?
I guessing by the content of your comment that you either live outside the US or are very new to US politics, I could be wrong,but as I said its a guess based on your comment. Libertarian foreign policy would work fine in an “ideal” world but the reality is that we don't live in one. One thing about our politics is that if you open your mouth and make a statement it is going to be scrutinized and others are going to wade in with their own opinions, which is their, in our view, God given right to do so. In this country if you say something someone else feels is wrong expect to get called out on it. The only way to be left alone is to pretty much not say anything.
As to bombing Iran, I must have missed that in the comments here, because after going over the posting I still don't see it. So I'll bite and throw this out for consideration. If Iran,bear in mind the Iranian government has on many occasions called for the destruction of Israel and all Jewish people, makes a move towards acting on this rhetoric, then yes, I absolutely would support Israel taking action in self defense and in the defense of their citizens. Remember there are more than just Jewish people living as citizens within the state of Israel.
In closing as far as the actual topic of this thread, which is Paul's opinion that the BLOCKADE of Gaza is not legitimate, He is wrong. - KeninMontana
Perhaps it is this you refer to?
“Peace, commerce and honest friendship with all nations–entangling alliances with none, I deem [one of] the essential principles of our government, and consequently [one of] those which ought to shape its administration.” –Thomas Jefferson: 1st Inaugural Address, 1801.
A great thought in concept. - davidegregory
I don't know enough about Ron Paul to be able to agree that he would have waved the white flag in 1941. I believe he would have been all for going to war at that time because we were attacked. Might he have not gone to war against Germany and only focused on Japan, I don't know, sometimes his foreign policy kookiness seems unpredictable. Certainly, however, he would have left them alone after winning the war. We would not be in Japan today, nor Germany, and they would have been left to rebuild themselves without our aid, if he had been the President at the time (not that I have a problem with that).
Paul seems to be opposed to any interventionist activity in other nations which would be in our best interest. In ways I agree, but in other ways, the methodology of war has changed too much to be limited to response in acts of aggression. Can we wait to be attacked in this day and age before we act? 200 years ago, we could gain knowledge of an impending attack as the fleet took weeks to cross the Atlantic. Today, it is only minutes before the missiles reach us. As the Bible says, we must be innocent as doves but cunning as serpents.
Oh yeah, sorry, in this nation we are supposed to have a separation of Church and state. Might have to scratch that last statement…NEVER!!
- davidegregory
Paul seems overly naive of foreign policy dynamics, and too easily succombs to the stereotypes. Israel is not preventing food and necessities from getting into Gaza, even if they are not making it easy. However, the story line has been that they are preventing everything from getting in from the very first and Paul has fallen for that line. He also is not savvy enough to recognize that to Islam, we, that is the USA, have been the great Satan since well before our “interventionist” policies. The USA embodies the antithesis of Islam, and as such is Satan to them. Israel is the little Satan, one, because it is little, and two, because it came on the scene after us, and lives to some extent by our leave. Don't get me wrong, Islam hates the Jews, but it hated us before it hated the state of Israel. Paul would have us believe it is simply our presence in the Middle East which draws Islam's ire. He is too naive, and his power base is exactly as it should be, that is the US House of Representatives, which deals primarily with fiscal issues and has little perview over foreign affairs.
- williamm
He would not have gone to war with Japan. He would have blamed us for being in Hawaii. If we had not fought in Germany, all of Europe and most of the world would be under Nazi control. If we hadn't stayed in Germany, we would have the Soviets controlling all of Europe and most of the world. Paul is against any sanctions against Iran and that is insane. There is nothing to stop Iran from building nuclear weapons which will be used against us if there are no consequences for their actions.
- davidegregory
Good point about Japan and our occupation of Hawaii. I hadn't considered that. And hey, he is right about that, because if we hadn't been in Hawaii, we wouldn't have BHO as president. Over-simplification, I know.
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- http://stopislamizationofamerica.blogspot.com/
- http://www.facebook.com/bruce.a.hedrick
- http://www.facebook.com/Tom.with.a.Dream
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