Good post, but it's not a new path. With Reagan and Goldwater being aberrations, the RINOs have always been in charge of the party. They are being a little more open about it, but that's because they're being challenged now.
The notorious liar Obama is spinning things around and if the republicans don't come up with anything he likes he blames them for the mess we are in, that HE/OBAMA created. Impeach Obama now.
Moderation and compromise are nothing more than words to make the phrase "capitulation to Dear Leader and the progressive/statist democrats" palatable to the conscience of spineless "republicans."
The GOP has no soul or solid principles now, and I won't go back to it for any reason. I've become a permanent independent and will only support candidates as individuals. I know many who have always supported R's, and they are done with them after this last election cycle.
The fact that we're discussing a potential split within the republican party means that the process has already begun. We've watched the leadership quite literally sabotage the hard-won 2010 victory of the Tea Party movement, by systematically making deals with the enemy, over debt ceilings, amnesty, pork, bailouts, you name it. We have had to fight two sets of enemies to the constitution: democrats and republican statists. I'm ready to sit back and let the former do the work of destroying the latter, and then take them on, no holds barred. The GOPe is an obstacle to recovery.
The GOP must stop courting RINOs like Jeb Bush. They learn nothing from their moderation.
I like the theory that, instead of an exodus from the party, all right-thinking people beat a stampede into it, swelling its ranks and upsetting the status quo. Could this transformation happen? I have no idea.
'With every force trying to break us up, you need to stop being offended that conservatives won’t budge, and start wondering what it is you do not know.' - JK
Not going to happen with the RINOs and Progressives who are presently in control of the Republican party. I am not going to listen to them tell me one more time why I must vote for another wishy-washy, useless, moderate-to-left, RINO Republican. My vote means more to me than that.
1) Secure the vote process, 2) break the LameStream, and 3) dump the RINOs and Progressives who call themselves the Republican Party. That is the only way we will ever win another election.
We have been tolerant and we allowed our party to be contaminated with RINOs who continue to sell us out. Too much tolerance is the reason our party is in so much trouble.
It's hard to come together when the RINO GOP leadership does everything it can to silence us. Look what Boehner did to the republicans who would not go along with his agenda.
We didn't start this fight, but I sure hope we finish it.
Here's how Thomas Paine felt about persuading a liberal.
I am not so optimistic. Two elections running hasn't gotten it through their heads that Constitutional Conservatives do - not - like - RINOs - and - moderates.
But no. Instead, they run ever more moderate candidates in the vain hope of peeling off Indis.
Screw the Indis! Try to regain your family-oriented, God-fearing, gun-toting, church-going base.
TWICE have I gotten along, plugged the ol' nose and voted for "our guy" only to be frustrated. Why should I carry on if the Republicans are going more Moderate and the Liberals are going full-out Fascist?
Nothing will change in the US until the people who elected Obama get what they want and we get the inevitable collapse it will bring. Why should I go along?
as this dictator in chief is turning the country into a communist state .. and reps from all states are going along with it, i think we have been way too patient... if there is a representive that doesnt go along to get along is demonized by both parties.... we have no representation ... we will be on our own to stand up and fight these criminals...
Face it, the only "Republicans" that are going to win in the future are RINOs like George W. Bush, Bobby Jindal, or Chris Christie. Give me a break, conservatism doesn't stand a chance anymore, NOT after the last election. The days of Ronald Reagan really are over. With all the massive entitlements, benefits, and paychecks being handed out by the Federal Government these days, I doubt a lot of people are going to vote AGAINST the very people who are sending them their checks. So you're going to end up electing RINOs like Christie or Jindal, where they just don't spend as much as the liberals but are still basically liberals. That old "compassionate conservative" thing, which simply stated that the government under Bush didn't grow nearly as fast as under Obama, but it still grew a lot. And the Republicans have nobody to blame but themselves. Perhaps the time of the Republicans has passed and it really is time for a new party, a true conservative party, to give people a clear choice between what they have now, which will drive us into bankruptcy, and what we can be, which are successful conservatives. The only possible thing that would allow another real conservative into office would be a total economic meltdown, as happened during the Carter administration. Barring that, conservatism in the White House at least is dead for now.
Is it 'true conservatism' to allow for the destruction of the nation when you know what will save it? I do not think so. Tocqueville talked of the resilience of the American people, there inherent tolerance and goodness. Look at the voting results in your own county, did all of those Obama votes come from committed leftists? Or was it because constitutional conservatism was not well articulated? I believe the latter.
"Learn what we know so that you can be informed."
We know, Jen. Maybe the "more hostile" sites need to read your message.
I like to think that *most* conservatives, and Republicans are more tolerant than those on the left. Personally, even if I don’t agree with someone politically I will always be respectful, and civil.
Sure, Democrats profess to be the party of peace and love, but they are often times- narrow-minded, and petty. I’ve found that face to face, they can become aggressive during a discussion, and more than once, they have become belligerent with me.
This isn’t to say that there aren’t some “bad apple” Republicans, or some good seed Democrats, but on the whole I feel the left is generally less tolerant to the concerns the right sometimes express’s, and a lot of times, they just don’t care.
The leadership of the National Socialist Republican Party will give you any lip service you desire, but they are an arrogant, racist brotherhood who approve Obama's courtship of industry and old money and has no use for individualism or, as it was once known, self determinism. The NASR Party members make NAZI Party members look like MACRO MANAGERS
The answers we seek will not come from the corrupted institutions displaying dusty, rotting American flags on their walls, but from within ourselves.
I tend to agree that they will give us lip service, saying what we want to hear. And why not? What 2012 has shown is that the argument "vote for any R is better than the D" resonates and will continue to be the position of the leadership. Those who did not vote for Romney were ridiculed, belittled, and blamed for the loss to Obama.
Though Jen's article is dead on, the premise is that the leadership will actually listen. So far, they have removed "grass root" voices from the Convention and kicked off conservatives from committees due to "loyalty". They are sending a message and it seems that conservatives are not listening if we are to think that they will be willing to change.
Conservatism is the step-child in the GOP and as long as "talk radio" leadership keeps trying to argue against a 3rd party the RINO's will continue to hold power and be happy with where we sit at the table.
Speak to the issues - a party platform of right vs. wrong and a plan of action that includes both use of Constitutional powers and civil disobedience - unity will follow. The left picks their leaders based on their ability to wield power - we gravitate toward whoever speaks the truth we hear in the voice of conscience.
Lincoln made the mistake of trying to get people to [literally] fight for unity's sake alone. The North was losing despite superior arms and manpower. It wasn't until he adopted the cause of ending slavery that he started to win.
We have no shortage of causes to fight for.
Well, Jen, former Sen DeMint agrees with what you wrote:
"Sporting his new hat as the head of the Heritage Foundation, former Sen. Jim DeMint said Saturday said that conservatives should not rely on the GOP establishment to deliver the movement's message. He said it is time to take matters into their own hands."
With Ted Cruz inside the senate, with DeMint blasting from the outside, and with Sarah Palin now free and surely already on the prowl - this will become very interesting, enver mind what the GOPe and the D.C. RINOs are planning!
Of course, the splintering has already begun and it didn't begin from the talk radio crowd. I observed this just before the November election when I volunteered in my local Republican county office in Ohio. We were a potpourri of people doing what we could to get Romney elected. But I noticed that the hard core established Republicans looked upon the Tea Party crowd as some crazed, angry third cousin they tolerated. They just used them to meet an objective. I tried to diplomatically defend these newbies in politics; saying that there are some very great minds and messages in this new crowd of people, but the Republican establishment running for election just didn't get it. These people don't see anything wrong with the establishment. Their goal is to head to Boomtown DC and join the club of corruption.
As a result, when the RNCC called three times begging for cash, I told them that I'd be giving my cash directly to real conservatives bypassing them totally. I also told this to the RNC when they called. Let's face it Jen...... We are the illegitimate children the GOP does not want. We are no longer content to hand over our monopoly money to them and follow blindly anymore believing their platitudes. I don't want to give the narcissist-in chief what he wants, but it seems that the RNC is destroying themselves without our help. It may be time to recognize that power hungry Republicans are driving an AMC Pacer. We crazy cousins may need to move on and go find a sturdy reliable Ford Mustang with the US Constitution in the glove compartment.
You make a good case JenKuznicki . I will say however the title of this sent me bristling so I had to re-read your piece. This may sound insignificant, but words are important in a 100% propaganda press.
Republicans, conservatives and constitutionalists have never been intolerant. It is not in our genes or our nature. The state media and liberal academia has branded us that way because they control the narrative.
Tolerence is a word controlled by the left. I know the definition you have in mind but guess which definition they use. Guess which definition 99% of the TV watchers think when they hear the word?
1. a fair, objective, and permissive attitude toward those whose opinions, practices, race, religion, nationality, etc., differ from one's own; freedom from bigotry.
2. a fair, objective, and permissive attitude toward opinions and practices that differ from one's own.
3.interest in and concern for ideas, opinions, practices, etc., foreign to one's own; a liberal, undogmatic viewpoint.
When we accept the lefts' premise we lose. Always. To say we need to be "tolerant" accepts the left's premise that we are now intolerant per definition #1. To become "tolerant " we will be held to definition #3, not definition #2. That is why accepting thier words and thier narrative is lose-lose for us.
What you outline makes sense but there is no foundation left within the Party to build it upon. Everything the Republican politicians do and try, is upon thier own shifting sands toward progressivism.
The Founders knew history - that any and all governments devolve into tyranny and totalitarianism. They knew that a party like the current Democratic Party would amass a majority of fools, opprtunists, and natural slaves to give them the power to rule over them.
It is not the role of the opposing party to compromise or be tolerant with the statists, to ease their design for tyranny. It is the role of the opposing party to dig in hard, to be the firewall, the last line of defense for liberty. The Republican Party has abandoned this most essential responsibility to the Republic. They have lost their way, their principles, their foundation.
Unless the Party proudly reclaims this mantle, and realizes that all is soon lost unless we declare full blown war against the the globalists and the Progressive Democratic Party, none of what you say will happen or even matter.
We are in our last days of the Republic. That is not exaggeration. Now is the time for determination, to build strong allies amongst free men, not tolerance and compromise with those who openly announce they intend to destroy our freedom and liberty.
We are in difficult days. I used the word tolerance carefully. It is not true that all Republicans have always been tolerant. I am concerned with the tolerance within the party of conservatives and tea party folks. In many states, conservatives are filling up precincts, we have to keep that up. I, for instance, do not tolerate the left, but I will tolerate another member of the GOP, and discuss my concerns with them on my terms. If we keep flaming at each other, the left will continue to harden us against our goals of resurrecting America.
Thanks for that explanation - I think cfpfan commented similarly.
I am trying to say also that the core conservative principles of the Tea Party that the Founders knew were essential to preserving a free Republic, should be the cornerstone - the foundation of the Party - not a fashionable or minority position for inclusion.
The Progressives build everything on core Marxist fundamentals. They brought some very opposing groups under the Democratic Party: Communists, Socialists, Liberals, Social Demcrats, Unions, GLBLT, LaRaza, islamists, unsuspecting traditional Democragts etc. They crack a hard whip that those principles are the basis of all they do - no one strays. Political posturing lets everyone save face. They divide the spoils after they win.
This is what the left thinks of the right and only the punditry and GOP leaders fail to realize this because they go to their little cocktail parties and don't get treated that way. I hate to tell you guys but you are being treated like an occasional Nazi treated an occasional Jew...the exception that proves the rule. They want you gone!
Holy Cow!! There sure are some humdingers of a bunch of right wing hate mongers on this site. WOW!!"
Now folks the psychology behind that kind of thinking taken to it's logical conclusion is annihilation. Think about the purpose of a statement like that and the lens one has to view the world to even think like that.
A lengthy posting...
If you are saying that the (ahem) leadership in the Republican party needs to quit relegating true conservatives in the party to the back bench... and that they need to embrace what the Republican party used to stand for (we now call much of that Tea Party principles), then I agree with you.
I don't like having to break away from the Republicans and go out and form a 3rd party... because there's strength in numbers... and the numbers aren't there for a viable 3rd party (yet). But if Boehner, McConnell and all the other double-dealing, fork-tongued, establishment, me-first, RINO, douchebag Republicans don't stop the insanity and spinelessness that they've so far displayed, then there's no helping it... we must leave them for they are ignorant, impotent and cowards. Useless. If salt has lost it's savor, then it is to be spit out.
I'm officially Independent. I will vote for whomever supports and lives and believes in classic Tea Party ideals and principles. If that doesn't come from Republicans... then I'm the splinter group who will no longer be led by the nose and vote blindly for watered-down Democrats. They offered us George W. Bush, then John freaking McCain, and then moderate but all-around-nice-guy Romney... when do we get someone who is real and will make a difference?
The real rift is conservatism is not being well defined hence the reason you have 'for' and 'against' camps.
The bulk of us out here in the hinterland...ya know the one's you rely on at the ballot box, define our conservatism by Reagan. Yes Reagan did compromise but his principles weren't fluid so he knew going where he would compromise and where he would not....AND HE MEANT IT.
Reagan as most of us out here in the hinterland don't underestimate our opposition. Yes the left hates you and the sooner you accept that is their chief motivator the better off you will be.
Really I could write a blog post longer than Jen's but what is most apparent to me is that it is 1856 where the Whig party died completely by 1858 and rose the Republicans that went on to fight the civil war and win. Right now the Republican party will probably die by 2016 and you will see constitutionalism rise in their place. The party may still have the same name but not the same platform or players.
Well stated! Reagan always treated people with respect. You didn't hear him talking about voters the way that the GOP does to it's voters.
It's interesting that the Riehl is more upset with Conservatives than with how Obama treats fellow Americans.
Reagan could see the big picture probably because he was in them but the rest of these Bozo the clown types can't see their own clown shoes.
That is correct but Reagan also had a clearly established set of goals that he would not be deterred from. Everything he did was to get rid of communism so all deals made, even on the economy, were with that in mind. He made vote deals but only with his bigger goals in mind. He knew what he would quid pro quo on.
He also took Franklin's advice and didn't tell Congress a damn thing. He and top cabinet members and aides were part of very elite and quiet cabal that orchestrated every deal with the express downfall of communism in mind.
Obama too has a clear set of established goals that he will not be deterred from and top of that list is undoing the Reagan legacy and annihilation of the Republican party.
Neither Bush had goals and just went into office as managers and Bill had goals but they were shot down when he lost Congress. Notice though his legacy is a good one? Why? Because he proclaimed the era of big government over. Clinton, whether forced or not governed, by shrinking the government. He did a lot of things though that undermine his legacy but not to the left. He is still very popular and with a lot of people, and in some cases, more popular than Obama. That alone should of warned the right at how much the electorate of the left has changed in how they view and judge the world.
And really it comes down to the perception of the electorate.
"There are known knowns. These are things we know that we know. There are known unknowns. That is to say, there are things we know we don't know. But there are also unknown unknowns. There are things we don't know we don't know."
Jen Kuznicki is one sharp lady. She hits many of the points the majority of Republican Leader(less)ship ignores at best and fights tooth and nail at worst leaving the few to try desperately to keep Conservatives in the fold. Time is running out R's. Get your act together fast or your self destruction is ensured.
It appears the only way to change is to have a christian conservatives in place for future elections. Why? Evangelical base. If that power can be turned around in the house, senate and someday the WH, then and only will things change. Sticking to the truth is tough but it is what this country needs. Yes I did say country because even the brain dead voter liberals will benefit from conservative policies.
Sorry, I couldn't get past Dan Riehl saying that the Left doesn't hate us. I'm stuck on how a very bright conservative blogger thinks this.
How do you even begin with that one? In order to win, you have to understand your opponent. Clearly, this is naive thinking. What does he think about the current gun grabbing campaign against the bitter clingers?
On another note, Ace's post on the media was dead on. How anyone on our side can have a problem with it from an intellectual standpoint is beyond me.
Lots of excellent points, Jen, and well argued, with a forceful conclusion.
"The leadership in the Republican party cannot sever its grassroots, so, they need to embrace us."
Indeed - but they seem to be hell-bent on doing just that, without even noticing that they're playing straight into BHOs hands - or, bad thought: is that their purpose?
Is the purpose of the RNC to still go along to get along, to keep the cosy D.C. set-up going, and never mind what is happening to the people in the country?
The Republican Party leadership has to get their collective heads out of that La La land called Washington DC and re-engage with your everyday common man Joe the Plumbers out here. That city screws with your mind just as soon as you enter city limits and if that is where you live then there is no hope of getting a true perspective.
Liberalism is a cult and Obama is their leader
Psychologically the current political landscape in the United States is like nothing we've ever seen before. The left emotionally "splits" any who disagrees with their dogma. Look at their rhetoric. Conservatives are "all bad" to the left. It's classic psychological splitting.
There is no way in hell you can have reasonable and thoughtful discussion/debate with the left. By their very nature they have the emotional maturity of 5 year olds. The only course forward is total political victory for the sake of the Constitution and the Country.
To put it more bluntly, tolerance or compromise on this immigration issue will be the death of the Republican Party. Moreover, not only are we not securing the border but we are importing voters for the democrat party. But, perhaps once they are here then we can covert them to the facts that they left a land where there was no opportunity for a land the encourages freedom, and opportunity. If this happens we will then see how fast the democrats will close and secure the border.
Jen, I appreciate everything you say. Question: what if the GOP does not take your advice?
I have concluded that the leaders in the Republican party have no inclination to embrace talk radio listeners or tea party conservatives. It seems a waste of time to continue hoping for their enlightenment/ conversion/ acquiesence/ acceptance.
As right as you are about the issues mentioned, and although it will gut the Republican party, my opinion is that the Republican party needs gutting.
I have loyaly voted against Democrats since 1980 (that's 32 years), and will continue to do so. However, assuming the current establishment Republicans will continue to come in a close 2nd in Presidential elections, I am willing to bring shock to their system by voting for a TEA party candidate. A 3rd party vote is not a wasted vote, if it forever changes the power structure within the GOP.
I think you are right on target. That's my gut feeling too.
There comes a point where optimism is just naive.
I've just about HAD IT with the GOP.
They don't care about true Conservatives, so why should I care about them? It's like a classic Democrat who just doesn't get that his party is something else.
How long will GOP voters continue to delude ourselves as well? I'm in favor of gutting the GOP and getting a true Conservative party. They lost 2 elections for us and don't deserve jack crap anymore.
Let them lose 1 more while we build up a good third party. The GOP can stuff it.
I hear you. I have been where you are - since McCain in '08.
We made great progress in 2010. But, by 2012, it became clear that the leadership would suppress the conservatives, and I have not seen a change in that attitude.
What we, the tea party types, have realized is that by winning seats in the house, we have not given voice to conservatism, but only strengthened the power of current leadership (Boehner). If Ted Cruz is successful, and the Republicans gain the majority in the Senate, will we be happy with McConnell's leadership? No, just more frustration.
I apologize for assuming you are wrong. Time will tell.
I am looking for someone to stick out their neck and challenge the R's. Rand Paul?Fine. Palin? Great. Allen West? Even better!! Should no one break out, I will vote for the Republican, again. But, I will not send money to support their party (throwing good money after bad). And I will not be surprised when the Republican party does not take your advice, or learn from past mistakes.
I don't know Jen. The establishment is more powerful than we realize. They're like a deer tick that has dug in deep. They're not just going to step aside and give up power.
We saw what happened this last election when Santorum was leading coming out of Iowa. Of course we never heard that until much later when the votes were fully counted. We didn't know because Obamney, backed by the all powerful establishment GOP put their entire financial machine behind him and essentially drove Santorum out of the race.
The GOP WANTED Obamney to win, and he did, just as planned.
I think our greatest weapon is education. You're 110% right about that. We have got to keep building up our position and values and selling them to the American people. This is what Obama does every other day it seems. Folks are constantly accusing him of endless campaigning.
UM, YEAH! Hello! That's how he gets his message out there! He sells himself as a "leader of the people" by coming down out of the ivory tower and rubbing elbows with the peasants. It's all fiction, we know that, but to the "low information voter", as Levin calls them, THIS IS "connection".
Republicans stand in front of a mike in Washington DC or go on a Sunday morning show and think they're being heard. NOPE! They're not.
What we need is more media outlets. More media means more coverage. Which means more voices declaring more information to more people. Fox News (as much as I hate them too) is a lone voice in a sea of noise. They are but one. We need many more.
This is the 21st century: PR! PR! PR!
If more conservatives join, rather than leave the party,in their own states, and fight for conservative principles, rather than get disgusted (rightfully so) at the structure, we can work together. If we consistently work for unity on our terms, it would be the right path in my view. The republican party does not need gutting, it needs education. Your suggestion to go third on a vote will cement the Republican party to be a consistent minority, something many of them might actually accept over constitutional conservatism. They have not been too keen on conservatism unless it is pervasive and cannot argue. It's up to us. The peasants have to fix the country. In my view, this is the way.
No you did not but you know, like the rest of us that compromise is the default position for the Republicans which is why many believe that there is not a dimes worth of difference between democrats and republicans. For example, how can we possibly conveience any Hispanic of ourConservative Ideology when George W. Bush started the foodstamp program and advertised it in Mexico. While Obama expanded the program GWB was the creator.
Dagnabbit. My clairvoyance must be acting up again. I was silly enough to respond to what you actually posted. I'm glad you changed it. The way you had it was incorrect. You said the Foodstamp program was started by GW Bush, and so I called you on it.
Was foodstamps advertised to illegals? No, it was not advertised to illegals in (1939-1943), Rshill7, which is the point that I was making.